| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
PaxLibano
France
39 Posts |
 Posted - 12/18/2005 : 11:35:28 PM
|
Reading some of the opinions in this forum and talking to many of my friends who supported the FPM in the parliamentary elections, it is becoming more obvious day after day that the overwhelming support that General Aoun had in the Spring of 2005 among many voters is eroding.
Many Tayyar activists see in that a natural fluctuation that takes place within the base of any party or movement in a democracy (except of course in the Syrian World, where the Baath has enjoyed constant support for more than 30 years) .
Others who call themselves former Tayyar supporters relate the erosion to the surprising shift in GMA’s position particularly his open alliance with Syria’s parties in Lebanon, namely Hezbollah, Amal and the National Syrian Socialist Party and the rift between the Tayyar and the Independence Movement of March 14th, 2005.
According to a well-known former Tayyar activist, he moved away because he “couldn’t understand why the Tayyar was allaying itself with Hezbollah in the student’s election” and “I felt as if we were asked to swim in the wrong pool”.
Another former Tayyar activist feared that GMA was giving cover to non-Lebanese policies either tactically or out of conviction but in either case, that was not what he aspired for after Syria’s defeat.
How do you feel about the FPM policies? Do you think the FPM’s popular support among its base is eroding? If yes, why?
It would help to know your political affiliation if any. |
|
|
The Whip
42 Posts |
Posted - 12/18/2005 : 11:51:09 PM
|
In answer to your question, although I hope no, I fear yes.
You can call me a former supporter of the GMA, but today I feal that what the GMA and the Tayyar stand for no longer represent what I stand for. In fact I said in the previous thread, I wish I can take my vote for the General back.
I hope this will be communicated to him.
I am sorry but the FPM no longer represents what I stand for or my aspirations. I cannot understand how my friends in the Tayyar who were beaten and tortured day and night by Syrians and their allies, are today allying themselves with these people and allowing the Tayyar leadership to forge such alliances.
We took to the streets when no one dared doing so. We were beaten because we were witnesses to Justice and the Truth. We bled and gave lives to liberate Lebanon from Syria. Why?
Is it only to give GMA a blank check? No my friends. We took to the streets for principles we believed in and we still believe in. National unity around a free, independent and sovereign Lebanon not for a Lebanon satellite of Syria.
This is why I cannot endorse the GMA politics anymore. And this is why I say YES: The FPM has lost the compass.
To my friends in the Tayyar who know me, I hope you will take part in this debate. I really want to hear what do you have to say in defense of the Tayyar's policy. |
 |
|
|
Pietro
Lebanon
64 Posts |
Posted - 12/21/2005 : 5:11:41 PM
|
The Whip,
Michel Aoun never had a reasonable compass anyway. I’m sorry to disappoint you but what you’re finding out now is nothing new for lots of other Lebanese.
Some realized this back in 1989. Michel Aoun led the Christian street to oppose Syria militarily, with no resources at all; it eventually resulted in weakening it, and it finally had no word in the coming negotiations…that were obviously to come since 1983.
Other Christian political sides knew they had nothing to oppose with and had to submit to the Taef, and so Aoun started his Annihilation big mess, not realizing it’s 30% of the Christian demography he’s “annihilating”.
Of course his only compass was turning around harshly back then because he was right at its magnetic pole: Baabda.
But the majority of the Christian street followed him for two reasons:
1) He promises and masses are mostly politically dumb (hey it doesn’t mean he should’ve openly declared it publicly on TV) so they follow radical slogans.
2) Samir Geagea’s LF, which was turned into a mafia back then, was disturbing it.
Aoun tried to do everything Martyr President Bachir Gemayel did, from resisting the Syrians to “unifying the arms”…forgetting that Cheikh Bachir didn’t achieve what he had by harsh political speech…He promised in his speech and worked politics and ground work.
Anyway 2005 came, and so did Aoun… Most of the loyal FPM supporters refused to see the Lahoud and most pro-Syrian support of his come back, and refused to relate it to the visits and contacts he had in Paris.
They also refused to remember that the Erslan alliance had been mentioned by Erslan back when Aoun was still in Paris and way before the Joumblatt “Tsunami” thing in the parliament…so spare me the “they cornered him” regular talk.
They also voted happily all around Lebanon for Murr, Franjieh, and Erslen…forgetting all about 8th of March or 7th of August… The most important thing to do is to get the General some parliament seats.
Aoun came back and broke 14th of March into two, and he fortified all pro-Syrian politics, but again the majority of the Christian street followed him for these reasons:
1) Everyone misunderstood the Christian alliance with Joumblatt and Hariri, seeing it as an allegiance. I didn’t think this way because I had the advantage of not being misled by Aoun’s speculations around them.
2) Joumblatt did a big mistake back then and I still can’t figure it out…He should’ve guessed that saying openly the insulting truth about Aoun will only double his popularity.
3) People were shocked by the electoral alliance of FM and PSP with Hizbulla…not realizing they are trying to assimilate the Syrian civil-war pump.
4) Aoun still promises more than he can afford, and masses will always remain politically dumb.
Since then, people have been realizing the truth. Part of them from Aoun’s put-off secret meetings with Lahoud, or from Lahoud declaring he would only resign if Aoun came next. Others from Aoun’s alliances in universities…but most from the current position of Aoun on the Hizbulla-Amal-Franjie-SSNP side opposing Sanioura…
Michel Aoun’s compass, since he settled in Rabieh, is pointing south, and today he is on the list of the obstacles in front of the government to resist any Syrian come back.
Michel Aoun has been promising and failing since 1989.
Some people have seen that long ago, some are just realizing…
Personally I even doubt Aoun would have opposed Syrian presence if he wasn’t on the opposite side from the beginning.
I summon all Lebanese to realize the Christian-Sunnite-Druze alliance is seriously the one and only spark of hope in Lebanon…Honestly it made me give up my hopes of partition…I summon all Lebanese to leave behind this self-destructing Nero so we don’t get destroyed along.
|
|
|
|
The Whip
42 Posts |
Posted - 12/21/2005 : 10:08:39 PM
|
Forgive me Father Pietro for I have sinned:
I have been a supporter of the FPM and I voted for Michel Aoun. But now I repented. The spirit has opened my eyes and I can see.
I stand whole-heartedly with my friends and brothers in the Freedom Camp on Martyr's Square demanding the removal of the Syrian puppet from Baabda, the election of a new FREE and truly Lebanese president from the camp of March 14th 2005 (Or March 14 number 2 as your Nero calls it).
My eyes are open and my mind is clear. I have come to see the truth. Michel aoun is a selfish power monger driven solely by an egocentric megalomania and an irresistible desire to control.
He is a threat to democracy, a threat to free speech and a threat to an independent and free Lebanon.
I wish I can take my vote back, but not until the next elections. But until then I will oppose him on the streets, on the internet, with my friends and anywhere I can.
I am ashamed of myself. Michel Aoun has fooled me twice. "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me".
Forgive me oh my brethren. |
|
|
|
Truth Squad
114 Posts |
Posted - 12/22/2005 : 12:01:39 PM
|
I believe it may be more constructive to argue what we like and dislike about the policies of groups or their leaders rather than simply state our feelings in emotional outbursts.
I think everyone agrees that our country is going through a difficult time. Most of us would want the politics to move in the direction of the March 14 movement, away from the Assad regime and towards a more independent and sovereign state. Some of us (Hezbollah and perhaps some in Amal) insist on staying within the zone of comfort of the Assad regime. The question becomes do we isolate them and risk them? Or do we engage them?
Isolating them with Lahoud may lead to a situation similar to that of Slayman Frangieh and the Kataeb Party in 1975, when those allied themselves with Syria and risk plunging the country in a new civil (or not so civil) war. Yes the international environment is not supportive of (not to say would be opposed to) a Syrian intervention in Lebanon (as it was in 1975) and is highly suspicious of anything Hezbollah does.
Engaging them on the other hand will have to be based on total Lebanese sovereignty including disarming Hezbollah. We cannot have a democratic coexistence between an armed militia and unarmed groups of civilians. There has to be equal opportunity and equal access for there to be a real democracy.
As for the FPM, I will not comment on their politics right now; I respect their right to freely exercise their role in politics. However, I do not hide that I was particularly disturbed by the Press Conference given by General Aoun on the day after the burial of Gebran Tueini. It appeared Aoun had two goals in that conference:
- Take attention off the terrorist attack on Tueini and subsequently the blame off Syria and for that he invoked the 1.5 Million economic martyrs; that struck as a cheap shot and a betrayal to the memory of martyr Tueini.
- Silence the freedom of expression in Lebanon by going after the media for allegedly ignoring him, and by attacking what he described as people with "diarrhea of words". That reflected a severe "constipation of ideas" for his part and a very disturbing precedent for freedoms in Lebanon should this man become president.
|
|
|
|
Pietro
Lebanon
64 Posts |
Posted - 12/22/2005 : 6:31:38 PM
|
The Whip,
Your words are too melodramatic for me to guess if you’re being sarcastic or being serious here.
Let’s just hope for the best…
PS:Add to my previous post: Aoun very frankly declared today the Chiite ministers are rightful in their position towards the government. |
|
|
|
Bullocks
66 Posts |
Posted - 01/18/2006 : 07:26:57 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by The Whip
Forgive me Father Pietro for I have sinned:
I have been a supporter of the FPM and I voted for Michel Aoun. But now I repented. The spirit has opened my eyes and I can see.
I stand whole-heartedly with my friends and brothers in the Freedom Camp on Martyr's Square demanding the removal of the Syrian puppet from Baabda, the election of a new FREE and truly Lebanese president from the camp of March 14th 2005 (Or March 14 number 2 as your Nero calls it).
My eyes are open and my mind is clear. I have come to see the truth. Michel aoun is a selfish power monger driven solely by an egocentric megalomania and an irresistible desire to control.
He is a threat to democracy, a threat to free speech and a threat to an independent and free Lebanon.
I wish I can take my vote back, but not until the next elections. But until then I will oppose him on the streets, on the internet, with my friends and anywhere I can.
I am ashamed of myself. Michel Aoun has fooled me twice. "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me".
Forgive me oh my brethren.
 |
|
|
|
Bullocks
66 Posts |
Posted - 01/18/2006 : 07:28:06 AM
|
| I agree, Michelle Aoun is losing his supporters. I blame his pro-baath policies |
|
|
|
Truth Squad
114 Posts |
Posted - 01/20/2006 : 8:37:29 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Bullocks
I agree, Michelle Aoun is losing his supporters. I blame his pro-baath policies
Welcome back Bullocks. Long time no see. I hope all is well. |
|
|
|
Shan
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 01/23/2006 : 10:25:48 AM
|
I am sorry if this question sounds stupid but I've been away from Lebanon for too long.
I read the Nahar paper online today and I was rather surprised to learn that representatives from General Aown (3awn) -- Salim Aown and Abbas Hashem -- attended a large gathering where Hizballa's speaker Nasralla harped on with the usual.
Where is General Aown going with his love affair with Hizballa? I simply don't understand this round-about pro-Syria position by supporting its allies in Lebanon. |
|
|
|
The Whip
42 Posts |
|
|
Shan
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 01/23/2006 : 6:22:49 PM
|
Walla?!! So now the armed Palestinians who shoot Lebanese are Zionist enemies? We have known the Palestinians for too many years. They are gangs who must be ruled with an iron fist as in Jordan since the late King Hussein put an end to the chaos they caused.
Regretfully, Aown seems to be getting senile or is playing a dangerous game -- trying to sweet talk Hizballa so that they'll support him for the presidency.
It is foolish to think that he can owe them that, then do as he pleases, if this is indeed what is in his mind. |
|
|
|
fraizzze
Canada
58 Posts |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 09:43:49 AM
|
Aoun should hurry to become president before Alzheimer make him completely out of our reality... This guy has a problem. Supporting terrorism is not acceptable in Lebanon anymore. Thats all I have to say.
Fred |
|
|
|
Pietro
Lebanon
64 Posts |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 6:11:00 PM
|
He could've waited until Edmond Naim's blood got cold.
Anyway RIP Edmond Naim, a very ponderable and respectable Lebanese figure. |
|
|
|
Truth Squad
114 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2006 : 09:36:45 AM
|
Again and again General Michel Aoun allows himself to be used as porte-parole for the pro-Syrian camp. His recent comments about possible acts of terrorism or riots that could lead to burning Solidaire or destroying Beirut are very unsettling and one may read in them wishful thinking, incitement and even a plan to disrupt any anti-Lahoud demonstration.
OK we get it. He wants to be president but he won't see it. He needs an attitude adjustment and a psychological evaluation to ensure his fitness for the job before deputies can contemplate his name for the post.
To all his supporters out there, we do not appreciate at all the way the General has hijacked some 17 seats in Parliement in favor of a pro-Syrian policy.
On the other hand, I have a question for GMA: how come in 1989 the arms of the Lebanese Forces were impeding his quest for freedom and sovereignty but in 2006 Hezbollah's arms do not present such an impediment? How come he could take the time to negotiate a deal with Hezbollah (an ideological ennemy to many of GMA's constituents if not most of them) but he had to rush into destroying East Beirut and killing hundreds, if not thousands, of its children in his crazy war? Is Hezbollah closer to the GMA's ideology than the Lebanese Forces are? or is it just a struggle for power within the Christian camp? (Ge7a ma biye'der illa 3a beit khalto!!!).
I say before the GMA is even considered by the Christian camp for a consensus candidate for president, he needs 1) to profer a clear bill of psychiatric health, 2) to offer guarantees that none of his family members (i.e. Gebran Bassil) or his pro-Syrian allies (i.e. Slayman Frangieh and his likes) will be considered for any ministerial posts or other high offices of the government. If any of you out there have concerns that regarding other serious issues with a GMA candidacy, please list them.
|
|
|
|
Shan
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2006 : 12:17:30 PM
|
To convey my displeasure with General Aoun, I went to the Tayyar website and frankly told them that I am disappointed in him and his position, especially after his meeting with Hizballa.
They responded and gave all sorts of reasons why his work with Hizballa was a good move.
After February 14, when there was no trace of him in the demonstrations, I went back and repeated my additional disappointment with him.
They responded and gave additional excuses.
As far as I am concerned, this man cannot be trusted. He has a hot head and may cause more harm than good by thinking he is right while he does not represent many who supported him in the past.
BTW, whom does Suleiyman Franjiyye represent other than himself? What is he going on about? |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
Did the FPM (Aoun's Tayyar) lose the compass?
Forum Locked
